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Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 8:33 am
by Marshall1
My son spotted a climber removing our draws off a route in Oudtshoorn. He raced to the base of the crag to find the climber still dogging the route, with our draws on his harness. On questioning he said he was taking them & our 100m static down as they had been left. The climber came down & Jaun-dray took back our draws. They apologized then & again the next day when a mate confronted them, but I think they intended to gaff our kit & I'm not convinced that they would have left our kit at the base of the crag it they were not caught in the act.

Obviously the kit was left unattended & thus did not matter that much to me. But this person+belayer must understand that this incident should not have ended as sweetly. Please be warned. This should have got really ugly.

On the bright side he left a newish draw & clip on the route, which he will be forfeiting. Thanks.

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:02 am
by DavidWade
Thats not cool.
Somone must remove my draws from a rout... there will be blood! :twisted:

They are probably beginners who dont know whats going on

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:06 am
by pierre.joubert
Probably not beginners, if the draws were on J's new route? Easiest route on the main wall is 22, so no.

Do you know who it was?

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:28 am
by Marshall1
They did plead new to climbing. They were in a new-ish white Pejero with WC plates. We have their registration, but I'm not planning to post it as this is a truely shameful act & prehaps they were not intending to gaff the stuff.

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:18 am
by wesleywt
Can someone please explain, why is it not rude to hog a route with your gear? This whole thing sound very stupid to me. But then again most traditions are stupid anyway I guess.

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:31 am
by pierre.joubert
wesleyt wrote:Can someone please explain, why is it not rude to hog a route with your gear? This whole thing sound very stupid to me. But then again most traditions are stupid anyway I guess.
How can you "hog" a route with your quickdraws? If there are draws on the route, and the guy who owns them is there, just ask and climb (no one has ever said no to me asking). If the guy isn't there, just climb. Don't take the draws. What is stupid/hard to understand about that?

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:49 am
by DavidWade
If there are already draws on a rout you want to climb, what a bonus. You dont have to place them your self

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:05 pm
by proze
Being self-righteous and making not-so-veiled threats of violence because he was nicking your stuff, and then taking his? Really? :roll:

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:11 pm
by wesleywt
pierre.joubert wrote:
wesleyt wrote:Can someone please explain, why is it not rude to hog a route with your gear? This whole thing sound very stupid to me. But then again most traditions are stupid anyway I guess.
How can you "hog" a route with your quickdraws? If there are draws on the route, and the guy who owns them is there, just ask and climb (no one has ever said no to me asking). If the guy isn't there, just climb. Don't take the draws. What is stupid/hard to understand about that?
How can you not see that leaving your stuff on the routes is rude. Especially when someone wants to climb it on their own gear. Gear that they trust and don't leave out in the open. What is so hard that you can't take it down? Are you climbing a 34 or something?

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:30 pm
by Marshall1
Ummm Pooze...I'm my mind he was planning to steal my draws & static. And is infact very f**king lucky he was caught by the younger Marshall. You are welcome to collect his draw & the righteous beating that he deserves..., really!

"Can someone please explain, why is it not rude to hog a route with your gear? This whole thing sound very stupid to me. But then again most traditions are stupid anyway I guess."....I had freshly bolted this route, but had not had a chance to climb/open it (was too hot & I too bushed) & remove the gear yet. This chop dogged up making knots in the static to remove my draws....not climbing the route or doing any of the moves. The route was way beyond him & there are plenty of other known routes at Oudtshoorn that he could have climbed, but he saw the gear on my route & went for it.

WTF Wesley, not stealing stuff is not a stupid tradition...come-on!

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:31 pm
by DavidWade
Ok so I am just going to assume that you have never worked a route for an extended period of time before

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:45 pm
by pierre.joubert
wesley wrote:How can you not see that leaving your stuff on the routes is rude.

Like this:
1. "Hmmm, I'd like to try that route"
2. "Oh, someone has left their draws on the route"
3. "RAD! I don't have to place draws on the way up"
4. "RAD! I can send, lower, go home, I don't even need to clean the route"

Or...
1. "Hmmm, I want to do a quick warmup"
2. "Oh look, someone has left the easiest route at the crag equipped with draws"
3. "RAD! I don't have to spend time placing draws."
4." RAD! The person waiting to do a warmup after me can do so without having to wait for me to clean, only to replace the draws like 30 secs later"

Or...
1. "Hmmmm, I've been wanting to try that line for ages. It's a bit above my level right now...so :/"
2. "No wait, someone has left draws on it"
3. "RAD! I can climb it, fall off as many times as I want, lower and go home"
4. "RAD! I don't have to leave and lower off a single biner just because I can't reach the anhors"
5. "RAD! I tried, failed, and lost no gear"
wesley wrote:Especially when someone wants to climb it on their own gear. Gear that they trust and don't leave out in the open

... a bolted sport route, on their own gear, not left in the open? I hope the irony is not lost?
wesley wrote:What is so hard that you can't take it down? Are you climbing a 34 or something?

I don't, but if the climber left his draws on the route that I saw him on at Oudtshoorn a week or so ago, then no, not 34, but in the 30s for sure. And I give Juan-dray a year or two and then the draws will be hanging on Streetfighter. Which is a couple of routes to the left, and yes, it is 34.

Dude, climb for a year or three, travel a bit and then you'll just say "thanks very much" when you see empty routes with draws hanging down.

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:49 pm
by pierre.joubert
NOOOOOOOOOooOOOOOooooOOOOO. I'm sure I just fed a troll.

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 4:53 pm
by Bubblyworld
As far as I see it, by all means leave draws on a route so long as you understand that there is a risk of them being nicked etc etc.
And if you want to nick said draws, then understand there is a risk of being chased by an angry, size-9-hex wielding climber... :roll:

Re: Possible theft - averted

Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2012 10:25 pm
by Franz
Not the first time I hear of a clown too cheapskate to finance his own rack, and then degrading himself to poacher status. Also, a similar scenario happened to me at boven some time ago. I was putting up a LOW grade climb for a beginner and then the rain came, so we left the draws there to wait for the sun to reappear, climbing close by on a dry route. Glad I got the bastard in time.

People like this do not deserve to climb.
Whats next? 'climbers' nicking your camping gear next to your tent while you are out climbing? "Oh, we thought you abandoned your campsite, sorry, here's your MSR back." These f##%$ should be removed from society: by invitation, suggestion or force.

You dont need lots of money to climb BECAUSE CLIMBERS LIKE TO SHARE, but dammit, leave the other guy's stuff where you found it (and in a better condition if you can), that way next time he wont mind giving you beta, or a catch on his gear when you need it. and Yes, some people save long and hard to collect the racks they build up over years. Respect it and they will respect you.

Maybe the climbing gyms must start an awareness program for the up and coming plastic gurus, to get them to learn how things happen on real rock.

grrrrrrr

nuff sed