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Bronkies access

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:46 am
by another newbie
Hi,

Can anybody please clarify what the formal access agreements are for Bronkies. We went their last Sunday, and were asked to pay R25 per car, previously we were asked to pay R10 per person, and while before that , we had to fork out R20 a person.

Each time there seems to be a different character with a different book, or piece of scrap paper, requiring some sort of payment. The R25 a car guy's book looked quite legitimate, but beware, we were stopped on our way out, buy another person demanding payment.

Can someone speak to the owner and perhaps suggest that they a) makes sure that the correct person with the correct book require payment. b) eliminate having to drive trough the house compound with the 2 gates. Surely they can station someone down the road.

Further, out of curiosity , who is the owners of the land. Is it Water affairs, or is the ground privately held.

cheers

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 2:53 pm
by marley
As far as I am aware the farm belongs to Frans (Maluleka, I think). I pay R10 per person.

I have also see some children with a book asking for payment, but I always ask for Sipho - he has been the guy to pay in the past.

Perhaps someone who has Frans's contact details should inform him that someone is stealing his access bucks and find out who we should pay to climb at bronkies.

There are a lot of climbers making use of Bronkies lately. I see more and more litter at the crag. Please guys, let's keep it clean - it has always been regarded as a litter free crag - let's keep it so.

Re:

Posted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 4:53 pm
by fridge
marley wrote:
There are a lot of climbers making use of Bronkies lately. I see more and more litter at the crag. Please guys, let's keep it clean - it has always been regarded as a litter free crag - let's keep it so.

Well we got back from brokies almost a hour ago and we saw no litter there.

O and we were charges R10 per person

Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 9:16 am
by Ronnie
To the best of my knowledge access is/was negotiated by the
MCSA and you need to be a memeber(or with a member) to use
this crag. I suggest this payment issue be referred to them for clarification.
Unfortuanatly I am not a member or I would ask them myself.

Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 11:09 am
by tangy
As far as I understand, only MCSA members can climb at this crag. Is this true?

Bronkies access

Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:59 pm
by DeanVDM
Hi all, apologies for the long post, but I think it is justified.

I'd like to make a call on all climbers, MCSA and non-MCSA alike, visiting Bronkies to please keep to the agreed procedure for Bronkies, this has been arranged by the MCSA for the benefit of us all and has been working well for a number of years. If we do not respect the fact that this is private property it might go the way of so many other crags where relationships went for a loop due to careless attitude of climbers (refer to the long list of sad discussions on this forum).

The current arrangement is (we’ll post an update here if it changes): you pay R10 per person per day at the house by driving to the front of the house. The money is usually collected by Sipho (sometimes by Sello (sp?)) who has a book that you must sign.

Unfortunately some people do not abide by this and on last Sunday there were at least two cars with reg nrs KGP820GP and MXW493GP that did not pay on entry (info from Sipho). At least one of these cars (maybe both) have paid after the fact when leaving, but the problem is that that irritates Sipho who have to walk 1km to the parking area and try and find the owners of the cars (a.f.a.i.k. he now collects the money on behalf of Josephine and he is checked up). To keep the peace I used MCSA money to pay for these cars. I know the arrangement is very informal and things does not always work out as it is supposed to (e.g. children collecting the money and the book goes missing), but please make an effort to pay on entry!!!

Needless to say that we should keep the area clean and be considerate when doing your ablutions (no real big problems have been reported thus far so thanks). NO formal agreement has been arranged for taking dogs or making fires and your discretion and consideration for fellow climbers are required.

As to the other questions and to shed some light on the happenings of the last few months: The MCSA bolting fund and the efforts of a small number of bolters were used to develop most of the crag. The original arrangement was for MCSA only members, but that has fallen away with time - the owners make more money in this way and this keeps them happy. The crag is NOT on Water Board etc. property (the Water Board only has a servitude over the property) and is PRIVATE PROPERTY owned by a number of individuals (read: complications). As of 2-3 months ago none of the owners resides on the property which accounts for the informal and sometimes hap-hazard way the money has been collected lately (before that things were handled more diligently because the was closer supervision). Behind the scenes the MCSA is trying to secure more formal access, but things are rather complicated (and getting more so). Our main concern is that if the owners become agitated by climbers not paying or causing other mischief that it might derail efforts to secure more permanent access. You just have to look across the river at the encroaching developments to realize where the threat to our access to this crag comes from. If you are interested in what is happening or would like to assist / offer help or would like to report problems, please contact the land and access or climbing member for the MCSA JHB or MAG sections or myself.

We’ll get into contact with the owners and post an update in due course. In the mean time and in the interest of the whole Gauteng climbing community, I ask you pretty please, with sugar on top, respect the arrangements that exist. Access to crags is the biggest threat to climbing we all face and once things go South even The Wolf won’t be able to help.

Dean van der Merwe (Cel: 083 274 1116)

Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 1:23 pm
by MarkM
On one or two occasions I've waited at the gate ready to pay my money before going to climb only to find no-one around to take my cash. On all occasions someone has turned up at the crag at some stage to collect the money and they didn't seem too bothered. I'm happy to pay the cash before I climb, there just needs to be someone around to take the cash.

Posted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 3:01 pm
by tangy
Thanks for all the info Dean.

I'm unfamiliar will this Crag... can anyone give me details on the variety of grades of sports routes?
What is the best time of day to climb there?
Does anyone have a detailed route guide?

Thanks :)

skelms

Posted: Sat Jan 27, 2007 1:28 pm
by mokganjetsi
ja, thanks for the info dean. that guy who collected the 25bucks per car had a book that looked really legit. we paid him and later the R10 guy confronted us because according to him we did not pay - we refused and had a rather heated argument with him. taking sensitivities into account, me thinks it is still the owner's responsibility to ensure proper collection of fees (?). anyways, hope we didn't p*ss him off.

tangy, there's a brief desrciption of bronkies crag on this site. you can also find a list of the routes + gradings on www.thecrag.com - about 35 routes grades 11 - 25. crag is in the shade only till about 11 o'clock in the summer (pity). much nicer than strubens - some decent long routes and a nice setting next to the river.

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 10:15 am
by tangy
Thanks for the info mokganjetsi! Will definately go check it out!!

Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 4:56 pm
by mkboy
Hi Tangy,

If you would like, you can join me to climb at bronkies this weekend?

I would be more than happy to show you the ropes so to speak;)

cheers,

mkboy

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:26 pm
by tangy
I'm glad to see the climbing guys aren't shy at all!! ;)

Hey mkboy... might take you up on that offer

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 9:37 am
by mkboy
Hi,

Really struggling to find a decent RD for Bronkies, tried the links above and the only result is that I now have the names of the climbs in no particular order that I can make out and their grade but no beta.

Is it going to be neccessary to contact MCSA to get one or just bite the bullet and buy Crags of Gauteng?, which by the way is pretty innacurate for the Chosspile.

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 1:59 pm
by Ronnie
All the climbs are marked/named/written at the base of each route.

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:07 pm
by stephan
The Crags of Gauteng guide does not include Bronkies. I would still recommend buying the guide, as it gives you valuable beta on some interesting crags in and around Gauteng.

If your current RD gives you the name and grade of the route, then what more do you want? As Ronnie says the routes are well marked.

Try http://www.thecrag.com for a RD.

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:18 pm
by mkboy
Hi,

Thanks for the replies guys.

Didnt realize the routes were marked, dont I feel like a right t*t now? :D

My apologies, I will go check it out as soon as I can.

Crags of Gauteng is no doubt a useful guide, will buy it in future, was just making the point that at least on the Harry potter crag at Chosspile the book is inaccurate (outdated?) because it implies that its an afternoon crag when the opposite is true and some of the climbs are not listed.

Anyone been to both Chosspile and Bronkies? Which one do you reckon is the better crag?

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:31 pm
by stephan
To ask which one is best is very subjective.

I like Bronkies more because of the easy access and it has some long routes towards the bottom. The sun does bite however after about 12.

At Chosspile you can move around to avoid the sun, but access is pretty crap.

The range of climbs at both are good.

P.S. People add routes at all the crags, all the time. You cannot expect a RD which was published some years ago to be 100% accurate, or that it will include all the routes. Be reasonable 8)

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 2:58 pm
by mkboy
Stephan,

You are exactly right man, it is subjective, was just trying to get a feel for what people thought of the two relative to each other because I have only climbed at chosspile and love the climbing but not the walk in so much :wink:

Re the RD's, right again, thats why the RDs on www.saclimb.co.za and similar I feel are more accurate because they can easily be updated.

I reckon there is still room for a lot of new lines at Choss and surrounds, Would be cool to get some new lines in there :D

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 3:38 pm
by guest
I reckon there is still room for a lot of new lines at Choss and surrounds, Would be cool to get some new lines in there
dunno 'bout that! unless you've found some secret hidden wall of rock behind a bush somewhere ;)

there are harder routes at choss, the rock is quite different. bronkies is a classic spot too tho.hard to say which is better! definitly access is easier at bronkies, but then choss access has a few tricks to make it easier as well.

Re:

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:06 pm
by mkboy
guest wrote:
I reckon there is still room for a lot of new lines at Choss and surrounds, Would be cool to get some new lines in there
dunno 'bout that! unless you've found some secret hidden wall of rock behind a bush somewhere ;)

there are harder routes at choss, the rock is quite different. bronkies is a classic spot too tho.hard to say which is better! definitly access is easier at bronkies, but then choss access has a few tricks to make it easier as well.
Maybe you're right man, wishful thinking on my part I guess :wink:

If you have a look on google earth there are several potentials in the area though and from memory, nearby the current crags but sort of right and higher (i.e. nearer to being above the tunnel) there looks like there could be potential, imagine the walk in for that :D

reckon its time to get to bronkies and climb something new

what do you mean tricks for easier access to choss BTW? Am I the only dumbass that walks up the long way? :D

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:55 pm
by MarkM
I've heard rumours that there has been some development on the slabby looking walls above the tunnel. Not sure if anyone can confirm this or not?

I'll have to take a stroll out there some day and have a look...

Posted: Thu Feb 08, 2007 8:25 pm
by mokganjetsi
OK, hoping that this will work - Bronkies route names and gradings below, listed in order from right to left as you face the crag. Might be one or 2 other routes as well. Climbs seem a bit easier for like grades at Choss. No smelly dam! No high grades! If you're lucky you can see the black eagle pair circling late afternoon. awesome.

Tickled Pink * [13, ]
Ranger's Delight ** [14, ]
Fragile Ego *** [18, ]
Straight and Narrow ** [21, ]
No More Freeloaders *** [15, ]
Fully ** [12, ]
Kief ** [11, ]
Derek's Dilemma *** [20, ]
Austin's Mojo *** [16, ]
Mini Me *** [18, ]
Rastus ** [17, ]
Man's Best Friend ** [15, ]
The Fallen Boot *** [15, ]
Gunning for Crows *** [17, ]
Kate's Moss *** [17, ]
Joint Venture *** [23, ]
Yellow Submarine *** [25, 20 m ]
Mostly Harmless [21, ]
+Elton's John *** [21, 20 m ]
Wild Apricot *** [15, ]
Naked Orange *** [22, ]
Green Machine *** [19, ]
Rule Number One *** [22, ]
Of Mice and Men (2 pitch) *** [22, ]
Fire Fly *** [24, ]
Black Out [, ]
Blue Suede Shoes *** [21, ]
Memoirs of a Belay Bunny *** [23, ]
If Women Were Gods *** [20, ]
Urban Raptors *** [24, ]
Rock Flower ** [17, ]
Squeaker *** [18, ]
P.M.S. *** [20, ]
Ex Girlfriend's Crack *** [19, ]
Fruital Brute [20]

Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 7:20 am
by guest
I've heard rumours that there has been some development on the slabby looking walls above the tunnel. Not sure if anyone can confirm this or not?
Mark & Rob were working on that crag. I wont post contact details for them here. PM me if you need their info. Have not been there myself, but apparently the walk in is a nasty one, but the routes are multipitch or 30m long. The photos looked awesome and there is a lot of potential for more routes there. As far as I know there are 7 or 8 routes so far.

mkboy - I dont want to come across as being constructive, so I would tell you about a little shortcut to Choss, but then, would you believe me?

Blue Suede shoes is the best route at Bronkies...it is superb to say the least!

Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:50 am
by mkboy
Mokganjetsi,

You are a legend!, thanks very much for the information :D

Going to check it out ASAP now, nothing wrong with the choss but if you climb 18 and down, your choices are limited there.

Guest,

Sorry to say this man but you have already been fairly constructive in this thread, you'll have to watch yourself :wink: ha!ha!

wonder why people tend to be so secretive when they open new areas/routes? surely it would make more sense to make the info public? Then access would become easier with more people walking in and possibly more routes would be developed faster, everyone wins...right?

Re:

Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:56 am
by JonoJ
mkboy wrote:
wonder why people tend to be so secretive when they open new areas/routes? surely it would make more sense to make the info public? Then access would become easier with more people walking in and possibly more routes would be developed faster, everyone wins...right?
The developers don't want anyone (in)advertently opening their incomplete projects!
:wink:

Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:11 pm
by mokganjetsi
hos hos mkboy. hope to see you at bronkies brah. climbers rock.